Morgan Schneiderlin


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Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby PES Stats Database » 2012 Jan 22, 21:35

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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby KeyserSoze » 2015 Oct 20, 15:08

The star which you describe is *Passing, if I'm not wrong.
*Playmaking simply makes the player dictate tempo with a mix of slow and fast passes.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby jurgens » 2015 Oct 20, 16:11

Welbeck19 wrote:I've reset the values to what they were beforehand and can only apologise for making a hash of everything.


Sorry, I didn't even see you that updated, it wasn't directed at that. Just browsing through the united forums and this is the second player I seen suggesting to get 80 def before even playing half a dozen games. That mentality needs to go.


ell then if this entire board is overrated, why not start a discussion in the mod section pointing out where we are going wrong? How can we fix it if we don't even know we are in the wrong?


These discussions have been going on everywhere for years... theres chats everywhere, maybe not focused on once place though.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby BigStu » 2015 Oct 20, 17:42

indeed, but those discussions made real progress in all the big leagues with active mods AFAIK, yes there are entire sections still in the old ways but the core database has been made much better surely, As for the matter at hand, agree that stupid mentality you mentioned has to go, he hasn't had time to show his worth at united yet, though actually was considering the update Welbeck made given his form at Soton. Guessing the 2nd player was Darmian, agree utterly stupid asking for such upgrades so early. Though I've technically been guility of it with Van Dijk.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Welbeck19 » 2015 Nov 05, 12:37

jurgens wrote:
Welbeck19 wrote:I've reset the values to what they were beforehand and can only apologise for making a hash of everything.
Sorry, I didn't even see you that updated, it wasn't directed at that. Just browsing through the united forums and this is the second player I seen suggesting to get 80 def before even playing half a dozen games. That mentality needs to go.


First off sorry for taking this long to reply and I can understand that it wasn't directed at me, however I still rushed the update on him and should have taken more time to think it through before going ahead with it.

I can understand were you're coming from in regards to 80 Def valuation especially after only a few games and it's not going to look right with several players on that valuation after a short period of time. Might be best to leave this set as is until after Christmas to see how he truly progresses over the season to get a better viewpoint of what does and doesn't need to be changed
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Welbeck19 » 2016 Jan 04, 20:56

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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Welbeck19 » 2016 Mar 20, 18:24

Why in the hell is he not a permanent fixture of the team? It's evident to anyone with half a clue that he makes a difference to the team and the stats back that up, yet somehow Van Gaal thinks it's appropriate to play Fellaini over him, even though he's useless as a DM and aside from defensive headers and being a general dick offers nothing in comparison to what Schneiderlin does.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Welbeck19 » 2016 Mar 20, 19:02

He had a few bad performances yes and I wouldn't say he's had a few months of being horrible considering he isn't getting a consistent run to even build up any form. The difference is that an apparently on form Fellaini is just as much of a detriment to the team than an off form Schnederlin. Whom if given a consistent run instead of games here and there would make a difference. The fact that United have a 57% win ratio when he starts and 28% when he's benched or injured shows there's something to keeping him in the side.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Frans » 2016 Sep 30, 22:36

Deserves a downgrade in passing stats at least. I remember him being quite creative at Southhampton but he's dire at United, looks like a liability in possession.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby jurgens » 2016 Sep 30, 22:52

What are you even basing that off? I mean, hes played like 5 mins in the prem this year. 2 games in europa with 91% pass accuracy. Thats all this year, i think?
2k mins in prem last year with 89%. So is he liability from 5mins this year, or the 2k mins last year where he maintained 89% accuracy (which is actually the exact opposite of a liability for an outfield player)?
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Frans » 2016 Oct 01, 15:23

I based it off watching him play for over two years at Man United? Enough to see he's weak with passing these days (along with most of his game...), no better on the ball than Fellaini and gets simple passes wrong quite often, nevermind actually starting any attacks.

Not just looking at passing % stats that mean nothing and making sweeping judgements, funnily that does sound like a yank thing to do :lol:
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby jurgens » 2016 Oct 01, 17:56

Not just looking at passing % stats that mean nothing and making sweeping judgements


Why would you say such a hurtful thing? I watch united too. As I've said a million times statistics are useful when used in conjunction with watching a player. Knowing what a quality passer he is and then looking at his passing statistics, it's easy to just disprove that his "passing is a liability" when he was literally the player with the highest success pass ratio on their entire team last season. I think you miss-understand how we rate things here.


Frans wrote:Not just looking at passing % stats that mean nothing and making sweeping judgements, funnily that does sound like a yank thing to do :lol:


You would know :lol: :lol: :lol:

Quick, better switch to one of your other 8 accounts after that burn!
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Frans » 2016 Oct 02, 11:16

So what, Matuidi isn't a passing liability with his 92%? He fails basic passes stupidly often. It doesn't mean a thing because the stat is inflated by a 50+ three yard sideways passes per game.

Knowing what a quality passer he is? Pre-conceived notions trump what he's actually doing then? Okay. If you watch his highlights vs Feyernood last week, or in fact any Man Utd game it's clear he's not deserving of such high values. Just keeps possession with the simplest of passes, rarely anything daring, pretty regularly fucks up a 10 yard pass. And really, Mourinho would never send him to bench for Fellaini if he was this kind of player anymore.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby jurgens » 2016 Oct 02, 15:38

So what, Matuidi isn't a passing liability with his 92%?


It's a fair point, but it ain't that simple. Matuidi isn't a liability because of his passing alone, hes a liability all round, his passing is pretty decent in general and you'd expect his passing to find its mark most of the time, it's just that he has moments where he forgets how to play over over complicates things so his game takes a hit. But it isn't his passing flat out thats a liability, it's him.

He fails basic passes stupidly often


Technically, if you just look at that statistic yourself, you'd see that there isn't room for it to be that often, statistically he missplaces passes much less than other players something like 2? a game, so it can't be that often.



It doesn't mean a thing because the stat is inflated by a 50+ three yard sideways passes per game.


Oh but it does. Because thats his job, and it's saying he has a pretty reliable success at doing his job.


Pre-conceived notions trump what he's actually doing then? Okay.


Definition: an opinion formed beforehand without adequate evidence.

I don't know if you are implying that hes just been assigned high passing stats since his southampton days based on lack of evidence, or you just used the wrong term here?

I'll just assume you meant, his past trumps what hes doing now? Well, with limited playing time and questionable form, yeah. When a player gets adequate playing time, and it's clearly not a form issue anymore then we take action.

ust keeps possession with the simplest of passes, rarely anything daring,


Not sure if you realize this, but you just summed up a DLP's job. What are you expecting here? Ever heard of Busquets? Should I knock down his 90's passing because of what you just said?


If you watch his highlights vs Feyernood last week


I watched it already, and I just watched it again to see what your on about. He doesn't do anything out of the ordinary, he keeps it short and simple, don't think he even misplaced a single pass. The thing is, thats a DLP's job, but when you watch them closely, and players like Schneiderlin, you'll see some beautiful passes here and there when they need connect play in a harder position. Depending on the player this can be very seldmon, doesn't mean they aren't a quality passer, butsquets is the best example of this there is. And you don't just drop from a high aptitude passer to a lower one, that just doesn't happen, we ain't fifa.

pretty regularly fucks up a 10 yard pass.


Again, statictialy there isn't room for that to happen.

And while I'm on it, that isn't an indication of bad accuracy, some players just switch off, some are just needlessly reckless in terms of making passes... taking no time or effort to set them up, just hit them in whatever way they come at them... this can lead to misplaced easy passes, but it isn't an indication of poor accuracy. Some of the best passer in the world are like this.

Again, I think you just don't understand how we rate things here. Many times I'll see you ask for a decrease of a players key stats, where they havn't declined in that area, just because they aren't in the best of form. Thats not how we rate things, we are not FIFA and we don't use anything like this to rate players. Poor form or good form, we rate a player based on what they show over a prologned period of time. This means if a player is poor form an extreme long time, and shows a high aptitude of trapping, they will be rated for what they've shown in that area. If they then have a crazy run of great form, the tech value won't change, as it's already correctly rated, the form isn't really relevant to it. Unless they jump from one extreme to the other, but in this example that didn't happen.


And really, Mourinho would never send him to bench for Fellaini if he was this kind of player anymore.


Sorry but HAHAHHAHA. That logic... let me apply it to some nice momemnts of his managerial carrer.

And really, Mourinho would never play Eto'o as a sideback if he was this kind of Striker anymore.

And really, Mourinho would never let go of Kevin De Bruyne if he was that good.

How about I apply it to Pirlo?

And really, Allegri would never let go of Pirlo if he was that good. Do I need to go on?

A manager not playing/calling a player has no bearing on their stats whatsoever. All through out football history incredible players have been iced out of teams, not played, played rotation roles, not even called for the NT, because managers are either stupid, ignorant, wrong, upset with the player, player doesn't fit in their plans, other players have more fitting qualities for their style etc etc. None of it has a bearing on their abilities.


I ain't saying Schneiderlin doesn't need decreases, he hasn't been this good since he joined united. But your logic and reasoning really doesn't line up with how we rate things here.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Frans » 2016 Oct 02, 20:35

Matuidi is just one example of many high % pass players who struggle to play simple passes for whatever reason. Kante's another, 90% this season and probably going to maintain that, yet I regularly see him balloon a ball into absolutely nowhere. So to say there's no room for it statistically, it just can't be true.

Not sure if you realize this, but you just summed up a DLP's job. What are you expecting here? Ever heard of Busquets? Should I knock down his 90's passing because of what you just said?


Busquets does show it though, he's constantly playing between the lines, one-touch balls across his body, can play any kind of pass. What Schneiderlin does, I don't how it's that's much better than say, Coquelin or Kramer... just marginally better. If I compare him to say Shelvey, a deep playmaker at times who has similar stats, it's light and day between what they show these days, especially in LPA. I'm prett y confident Schneiderlin does fuck up quite regularly in accuracy, but tbh there's limited coverage on youtube etc. He's been okay to downright awful in the last year.

Again, I think you just don't understand how we rate things here....


Fair enough, I likely don't. I'm saying he's not showing he's as good as a distributor and you're saying it's down to form rather than a decline in technical abilities? I get it sort of, but it still doesn't look right, because on his day he'd be capable of doing things he just doesn't really do (from what I've seen). Especially in regards to long passing.

A manager not playing/calling a player has no bearing on their stats whatsoever.


That's fair, but I still think it begs the question. The De Bruyne (youth that Mou doesn't care for) and Eto'o (better/more inform Milito) you can see logic to Mourinho's decisions, and I'd value his judgement high in picking his starting XI. It's nothing on its own, but I'd say it's just another sign he's not this player.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby jurgens » 2016 Oct 03, 02:24

yet I regularly see him balloon a ball into absolutely nowhere.


How regular can it be when they misplace like 2 passes a match out of 40+? I'm getting tired of this.


What Schneiderlin does, I don't how it's that's much better than say, Coquelin or Kramer... just marginally better. If I compare him to say Shelvey, a deep playmaker at times who has similar stats, it's light and day between what they show these days, especially in LPA.


I know he doesn't show it all the time, but I have seen him playing incredible passes throughout his time at united, so much so that I made an effort to watch as much as I could of him last year.

Just looking at one of his recent vs vids

https://youtu.be/OzPoAmo_5gs?t=24
https://youtu.be/OzPoAmo_5gs?t=130

clearly he does pull of good passes you'd never see anything like that from kramer

im not looking through more i can't be botherd, i assume this has tones https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeCsEmg3SJo and this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QU01lLp5kRc


I'm saying he's not showing he's as good as a distributor and you're saying it's down to form rather than a decline in technical abilities?


im saying, the stats he had were fitting, if hes not showing it now there could be a multitude of reasons, and the least likely is hes lost the ability, and you are being overly harsh. hes showing some nice stuff here and there, like those 2 passes above, even if its seldom.


Eto'o (better/more inform Milito)


this wasn't even the case, eto'o came from his best ever season, and milito wasn't a big name and eto'o wasn't playing bad, next season eto'o playing as cf again had a record breaking year. Hes done similar things throughout his carrer, it doesn't reflect on the player.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Relja » 2017 Jan 12, 19:21

Schneiderlin is really quality, but Everton is full of defensive midfielders, i am not sure that they need him at the moment. Barry is in very good conditon and i think he can play there in the next season too. They must buy a keeper, a left back, a central defender, the second choice striker, but a DM...
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Phil » 2017 Mar 05, 00:04

What a waste Schneiderlin was at United. This guy is a quality midfielder and will most likely be a brilliant bit of business for us, seems to have already created a good relationship with Gueye and Davies.

Speaking of Davies, I don't think he has a set here does he? He is looking a very promising player for us. I could probably try and create a set for him at some point if anybody else has any input too.
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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby Moysís » 2018 Oct 27, 08:29

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Re: Morgan Schneiderlin

Postby anOKguy » 2018 Dec 24, 21:26

On my list of most over-powered players in the PL on the database, he has really not shown anything close to this more than glimpsingly for the past few years since leaving Southampton. His defense and att values are higher than what he shows. Further, his passing is less sharp and he commits stupid turnovers frequently for the type of balls he tries to play. Form too down.

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