Alexandre Song

[PES Stats Database]

[deity86]

Just wanted to bring the suggestions up again, I think most importantly his SPA definitely needs to be lowered.. he looks out of place with Denilson and Hargreaves on 78 The suggestion was:

Short Pass Accuracy: 74

He likes to keep his passes simple but is capable of that killer pass, but not regularly enough to deserve a higher value in my eyes.

[Vandeach]

I don't really think thats fair, your right in that he likes to keep his passes short but remember his relatively low team-work for midfielder with a 74 in SPA aswell he will be a very inaccurate passer plus the current value is hardly overrating him it puts him 1 below David Dunn and I think that's fair.

[deity86]

Alright, looking at the ladders a bit more I still don't think he should be where he is currently. Maybe a 76 could fit him better?

[Spaceman]

Agree with that, he mostly keeps his passing simple, but his LPA could go up to say 75? He is capable of pinging some nice balls into the box from the centre to the strikers to latch on to.

His improvement as a DM has been brilliant in the last 2 months. His positioning defensively and knowing when to support the attack is a completely different animal to the start of the season.

[deity86]

I've been paying a bit more attention to Alex lately, he seems to have stepped up his game alot since the turn of the year and I think there's a few issued to add to suggestions already made.

I'll start off with current discussions..

Acceleration: 79/80

I think it's clear that he's faster over a longer distance, not so great at bursting off the spot. I do feel inclined to stick to the suggestion of 80 but a 79 could work too.

Agility:

There were a few varied values suggested and although I agree it needs to come down I feel we were a little harsh on him. I also know we have to be careful right now and not just judge him on his very good run of form. I agreed before but I'm not sure going down to 78 is right.. looking at the ladder I'd say a 79/80 would suffice.

SPA:

I still think 78 is a tad too high but agree that my 74 suggestion may just have been under-estimating him a bit. He is capable of being a very decent passer on his day but mostly opts for simple sideways/backwards passes. I feel that a 76 does suit him well on a "normal" day.

LPA:

Spaceman suggested a 75.. I'm sort of undecided on this. He's certainly improved his passing over the season and I do feel he's become more adept at picking out little passes over the top and generally his passes across field are better. That being said, I do feel he can perform these with a 73 for LPA.. more comment here would be better.

The talk of Response got me thinking a bit more. His ability to intercept and read the game has improved this season aswell. I do agree that this could go up to 82, but if we do this I feel we need to look at another area which leads me to a few of my own suggestions..

Attack/Defence/Mentality:

While his Response has improved I feel he's getting himself out of position more often. I think this is due, in part, to the fact that he's also upped his work rate. He's no Mascherano but he seems to chase around alot more now, pressurising the player on the ball but leaving open spaces in the middle of the pitch. It's not just this but he can be a bit soft in the tackle sometimes also, resulting in him not coming away with the ball. Don't get me wrong I know he's good defensively but I'm starting to feel it's more of a Response/Mentality thing rather than a positioning/tackling thing.

I feel we could bring his Att/Def ratio a bit closer, he's become more comfortable attacking this season and seems to be a bit more intelligent in the oppositions half. I'm not suggesting anything drastic here but P. Neville has a 66 for Attack and I feel Song could sit level or 1 above. Also looking at the Defence ladder for DM/CM I do think he could come down a point or two but only if there were to be a Response raise.

I don't want to put forward any concrete values for my suggestions yet, just wanted some views on them

[Vandeach]

You do raise good points there but the thing I disagree with lowering is SPA, Song has proved over the years that he is a more than capable passer, remember when he went on loan to Charlton he was spraying great passes left, right and centre, I know he has become more conservative with his passing but I would still put him above Lee Catermole, at the moment he is one point behind David Dunn, which I think is fair. I agree with the attack,response,acceleration,agility and LPA 75. And to be fair I could see his defence going down 1 point, but no more remember he can be a very good centre-back when played their.

[deity86]

Again I see where you're coming from with his SPA, and yes I remember him at Charlton where he seemed to transform into some sort of playmaking monster I think we're both gonna stick to our guns here with the 76 and 78 suggestions so do you think a compromise of 77would work? He'd be level with Wright-Phillips and Keane, both capable of neat short passing.

[Vandeach]

To be honest I still think he's better than the two you've mentioned when will you ever see either of those performing complicated passes. Never/Very rarely. Whereas you can still see Song perform a breathtaking pass, not as often as when he was at Charlton, but he still can occasionally.

[Spaceman]

On a totally different subject I want to discuss his shooting stats, now obviously he doesn't deserve anything near good or average even, but comparing him to players of comparable ability his stats seem very low.

Anderson
Shot Accuracy: 68
Shot Power: 84
Shot Technique: 70

Lucas Leiva
Shot Accuracy: 73
Shot Power: 81
Shot Technique: 72

Obi Mikel
Shot Accuracy: 72
Shot Power: 84
Shot Technique: 73

Reo Coker
Shot Accuracy: 70
Shot Power: 82
Shot Technique: 67

Bearing in mind all of these players are fairly rubbish at getting a shot on target I believe obi and Anderson have not scored for their respective teams? Song at least as hit a difficult shot on the volley in the champions league, and the clinical finish against Wigan recently

What numbers would I give him? not sure but he should at least be similar to the players listed above. Currently he is the lowest in all 3 areas of SA, SP and ST out of the group, which is a little unfair. Agree?

[Alcohomicide]

To be honest I still think he's better than the two you've mentioned when will you ever see either of those performing complicated passes. Never/Very rarely. Whereas you can still see Song perform a breathtaking pass, not as often as when he was at Charlton, but he still can occasionally.

Difficult. I want to agree with you because when he's confident he has a good range of passing, and can certainly pick people out. I'm not sure that's exactly his game at Arsenal, though. I've seen him pull a few good passes, including a very good one over the top (In the cup), but generally his job's to make useful passes to the more creative players. ...Which is not to say he's not creative, because when he's given the license he can be.

[quincy_huang]

On a totally different subject I want to discuss his shooting stats, now obviously he doesn't deserve anything near good or average even, but comparing him to players of comparable ability his stats seem very low.

Anderson
Shot Accuracy: 68
Shot Power: 84
Shot Technique: 70

Lucas Leiva
Shot Accuracy: 73
Shot Power: 81
Shot Technique: 72

Obi Mikel
Shot Accuracy: 72
Shot Power: 84
Shot Technique: 73

Reo Coker
Shot Accuracy: 70
Shot Power: 82
Shot Technique: 67

Bearing in mind all of these players are fairly rubbish at getting a shot on target I believe obi and Anderson have not scored for their respective teams? Song at least as hit a difficult shot on the volley in the champions league, and the clinical finish against Wigan recently

What numbers would I give him? not sure but he should at least be similar to the players listed above. Currently he is the lowest in all 3 areas of SA, SP and ST out of the group, which is a little unfair. Agree?

First of all i think anderson is overrated =)
But i agree with ur idea
More discussion and opinion needed

[zebastian]

Add CM. He plays sometimes on this position.

[Vandeach]

Given him the needed tweaks.

[chanman]

I think his defence can come down a little too, possibly a 75/76 leaning more to the lower value to accommodate the ladders. Also a raise in response is a must too. I know he can play in CB but Song's positional sense in nothing but average right now.

Also does CMF need to be added as a position for him?

[qwerty]

76 in technique is way to harsh! he deservers at least [color=#FFFF00]80[/color]

i mean many top-CB´s have better technique than him? i dont think so...

[qwerty]

oh sorry.. but he really needs an update in technique! 76 is to harsh, he deserves at least 80

[quincy_huang]

while everyone is focusing how well Varmaelen did in the game against everton
i think i should mention Song as well
he did a great job in DMF, covering, sliding,convert defence to attack and dribbling(he showed on 1st half)
2yrs ago he is a "boom" of arsenal, everyone is scaring that he is on the pitching
and now he shows a consistant improvement since last season and by soon, he might be the solution of arsenal DMF

[lunboy814]

Song has reached a great improvement in the past half year. I am quite surprised his overall stat is at such a low level. The above discussion seems very harsh. For example, although his passing is not very penetrating, 74 as the above suggests is surely far too low. You can compare this with other CBs, for example Gallas and Djourou. If they deserve a green passing, why can't Song have a yellow passing, at least a very close value?

[kendees]

Song is very promising Arsenal player, I hope Wenger will him use always as DMF, not CB. His positioning at DMF is brilliant, reading of the game wonderful! He is quite fast and good passer. He has everything what a quality DMF needs to have, maybe his shooting could improve a bit, for a central player is important to smack the ball from the middle sometimes.. but for now it isn't his work, for me Man of the Match yesterday. I don't want to make any suggestions, but I belive that his response, balance, passing, mentality and TW will be raised in winter/New Year, but we must wait a bit before updating...

[Ken]

Mentality, TW and DA are the one which I can see an increase soon, the others for example his passing does not need a raise for now. I feel his passing is just like Denilson, nothing spectacular, but I still feel Denilson's passing is horribly underrated cause when we talk about his passing the first word come to people's mind is always "wayward" but in truth it is not.