Neymar

Moderators: Korinov, brazilianpesfan, Fixer, Mod's

Neymar

Postby PES Stats Database » 2009 Mar 19, 01:54

Image





VIDEOS:
Spoiler: show


Last edited by jurgens on 2014 Jan 04, 23:27, edited 4 times in total.
Reason: updated picture
User avatar
PES Stats Database
 
Posts: 9790
Joined: 2008 Dec 09, 12:06
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 117 times

by »



 

Re: NEYMAR

Postby furymaker » 2012 Jun 06, 14:54

I don't watch Santos a lot , watched few games that were at decent time , watch almost every Brazil game and game vs Barcelona , from my point of view , especially in last match against Mexico , he was garbage , you could see small and short flashes of his brilliance , but nothing impressive . Mexico got him to the ground few times and after that he disappeared from the game , guess it's just lack of experience .
In games I've watched he is not the player stats or youtube highlights make him to be , my thoughts of him aren't as high as they were on Messi or Pato for that matter .
I know I can't base anything on him from small amount of games I've watched but I think all this media talk and Pele's trash talk made him better than he is or it's just that he is so young and lacks experience :S

furymaker
 
Posts: 896
Joined: 2011 Aug 23, 01:23
Has thanked: 66 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby vinnie » 2012 Jun 06, 19:14

I was going to say that I thought Neymar is too too easily neutralised in NT games against european (or even just NT level) defenders. He isn't even as dangerous as Damiao who is at 86 ATT imo...
What do brazil mods say about ATT?

If you don't put effort into your post, i won't put effort in my response.
User avatar
vinnie
 
Posts: 3585
Joined: 2012 Apr 06, 03:11
Location: ♛      
Has thanked: 363 times
Been thanked: 535 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Vickingo » 2012 Jun 06, 19:31

Sinceraly I don't know where is based that affirmation. Neymar's dangerousness is something unbeliavle. He only played 17 games at NT and he scored 9 goals right? I know that goals aren't the best to relate that...but he's a fucken beast. In this case I think that real opinions are from guys that usually watch his entire games as brazilian users are atm, or at least Copa Libertadores' matches mixed with some of brazilian. It's obviously inflated by the press and Pelé for sure as always happens, but say that this guy isn't so dangerous is just...wrong. Damiao is a best but imo it's another style that can't be compared in terms of ways. It's true that vs Vélez he was well neutralised and he didn't play too much good, even bad but Argentinian teams and defenders are more hard and like Europeans, but I don't think that having a bad match means that. Problem is that he's so diver, irritant. If he'd dedicate his time to play instead of diving and make tricks, for sure he'd be more effective. And hey, sometimes we forget that this guy is 20. For sure he should work in some things like that, but his quality and dangerous imo are indisputable.

User avatar
Vickingo
 
Posts: 13122
Joined: 2010 Jun 09, 02:18
Location: Argentina
Has thanked: 548 times
Been thanked: 356 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Mr. Evans » 2012 Jun 06, 20:18

It's weird but whenever I watch him in the Brazilian NT, he fails to impress me. Doesn't mean too much but it frustrates me as I always get excited about the prospect of watching him, due to all the hype.

thor34 wrote:JUMP: 80/81/82. Digestible methionine and leap up to splice the header. From what I saw the half-length coat will easily to Angeleri.
Mr. Evans
 
Posts: 2821
Joined: 2010 Nov 03, 10:58
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 7 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Vickingo » 2012 Jun 06, 20:33

Mr. Evans wrote:It's weird but whenever I watch him in the Brazilian NT, he fails to impress me. Doesn't mean too much but it frustrates me as I always get excited about the prospect of watching him, due to all the hype.


I don't blame him...it's kinda lots of world class player at their NT...and more taking into account his age. He's far from being the new Messi or so, that's just stupid but this guy being calm will be a great thing if he worries more about playing than diving/fame, thing that I see difficult. Well, let's watch him this saturday vs Argentina if he could show more of his potential vs a big team with 1st team (hope not :D).

User avatar
Vickingo
 
Posts: 13122
Joined: 2010 Jun 09, 02:18
Location: Argentina
Has thanked: 548 times
Been thanked: 356 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby furymaker » 2012 Jun 06, 20:51

that was my point , every game of him I've watched I have been left disappointed , sure he got talent , but doing what he does in Brazilian league for me is not enough for ratings like these :S

furymaker
 
Posts: 896
Joined: 2011 Aug 23, 01:23
Has thanked: 66 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Vickingo » 2012 Jun 06, 21:05

furymaker wrote:but doing what he does in Brazilian league for me is not enough for ratings like these :S


So Riquelme shouldn't have those ratings, neither Deco, Damiao, Camoranesi, Trezeguet, etc? Totally disagree with that statement, it's just so wrong. If a player is good, is good here or in China.

User avatar
Vickingo
 
Posts: 13122
Joined: 2010 Jun 09, 02:18
Location: Argentina
Has thanked: 548 times
Been thanked: 356 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby vinnie » 2012 Jun 06, 21:08

good point, i agree there. Even then, i was already comparing to european stars and NT stars, not just brazil league :). lets see how he does at the olympics.

If you don't put effort into your post, i won't put effort in my response.
User avatar
vinnie
 
Posts: 3585
Joined: 2012 Apr 06, 03:11
Location: ♛      
Has thanked: 363 times
Been thanked: 535 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby furymaker » 2012 Jun 06, 21:33

vickingo_73 wrote:
furymaker wrote:but doing what he does in Brazilian league for me is not enough for ratings like these :S


So Riquelme shouldn't have those ratings, neither Deco, Damiao, Camoranesi, Trezeguet, etc? Totally disagree with that statement, it's just so wrong. If a player is good, is good here or in China.

i didn't say they don't deserve ratings like that . Deco played at world class level for long time , even in top leagues in europe as well as for national team , so did camoranesi and trezeguet .
Neymar is rated as one the best players in here , still , when he faces little tougher defences , he's nowhere near the level they say he is . I can't explain it , but he hasn't proved his class , yes he did , in youtube videos and hearts of young girls .

furymaker
 
Posts: 896
Joined: 2011 Aug 23, 01:23
Has thanked: 66 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Odi1981 » 2012 Jun 06, 22:43

Odi1981 wrote:TRANSLATE....
TW I think is very wrong! In the game it appears that he was not present and did not seek this game with low value (72). If you watch a game it will see that he come to the midfield get the ball to build a play or table ... For this to happen in the TW game should be a minimum of 80, though so probably it will engage with marking too! But the fact that he have more to compensate for this game because its movement is more realistic to what he has in the games! I suggest 83 TW! Anyone agree?


:arrow: @Vickingo>>>>>>Analise essa questão...ele faz tabelas, busca o jogo no meio campo etc...com 72 TW ele nunca fará isso! Eu sei que você talvez tenha visto ele contra o Velez mas essas foram as piores atuações dele no ano! Se concentre na minha idéia e um valor para ele produzir o que cito na primeira linha!
TRANSLATE...
Consider this question ... it does tables, search the game in midfield etc ...with 72 TW it will never make it! I know you may have seen him against Velez but those were his worst performances in years! Concentrate on my mind and a value for it to produce what I quote the first line!

Odi1981
 
Posts: 427
Joined: 2010 Aug 10, 01:16
Location: Brazil
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Anders » 2012 Jun 09, 00:39

Odi1981 wrote:TW I think is very wrong! In the game it appears that he was not present and did not seek this game with low value (72). If you watch a game it will see that he come to the midfield get the ball to build a play or table ... For this to happen in the TW game should be a minimum of 80, though so probably it will engage with marking too! But the fact that he have more to compensate for this game because its movement is more realistic to what he has in the games! I suggest 83 TW! Anyone agree?


What I said a time ago:
Anders wrote:I have take a look on Konami default stats of him, find quite interesting his TW (78)

Anders wrote:Removing Dummy would open a new space for a card; I would go for 1-1 finisher as he is so calm in front of the keeper.

He is going to move a lot even with this TW thanks to Dummy Runner, but I was thinking to remove it, not just to create one more slot for card, but because I think dummy is slight overkill, After playing even more with 78, I'm sure it isn’t enough to replicate his movements, so you probably is right with this 83.

About how dangerous he is, some numbers at Santos 185 games, 108 goals and 50 assists on 4 seasons. Just by number he looks dangerous enough to deserve that 89, even without counting how smart he is, his vision, how he is taking good decisions, etc.

User avatar
Anders
 
Posts: 1587
Joined: 2010 Apr 01, 17:27
Location: Brazil
Has thanked: 10 times
Been thanked: 13 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Luizinho94 » 2012 Jun 09, 22:22

He is really dangerous, but only proved this in Brazil. While he did not play the same way in the national he should be at most 86 in the attack. But we can not deny that he is able to be in a future 90 +

User avatar
Luizinho94
 
Posts: 61
Joined: 2012 Jun 06, 13:38
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time

Re: NEYMAR

Postby midnight » 2012 Jun 09, 22:33

agree with what you said Luizinho ,86/87 is more suiting IMO, even he is a permanent threat in Brazilian serie a games,
btw,you can't say what he can become before watching him with bigger teams, maybe he'll stay on this actual ATT who knows . . .

EDIT : i suggested that downgrade by taking in count the lower league balance too not only his performances .

Last edited by midnight on 2012 Jun 09, 22:50, edited 2 times in total.
Fixer - Fri Aug 02, 12:19 am
I'm gay
Fixer - Fri Aug 02, 12:19 am
See Shiterable? There's nothing to be ashamed of

Image
User avatar
midnight
 
Posts: 2024
Joined: 2012 Mar 06, 13:48
Has thanked: 283 times
Been thanked: 110 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Odi1981 » 2012 Jun 09, 22:41

I do not agree with the last two post. I think the issue is the mentality, should reduce it!

Odi1981
 
Posts: 427
Joined: 2010 Aug 10, 01:16
Location: Brazil
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Luizinho94 » 2012 Jun 09, 22:48

midnight wrote:agree with what you said Luizinho ,86/87 is more suiting IMO, even he is a permanent threat in Brazilian serie a games,
btw,you can't say what he can become before it watching him with bigger teams, maybe he'll stay on this ATT who knows . . .


I told that he can be if he prove all the talent that he has, as he can be 'only' at this level.

User avatar
Luizinho94
 
Posts: 61
Joined: 2012 Jun 06, 13:38
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Luizinho94 » 2012 Jun 09, 22:49

His mentality can be reduced as well, because he disappears completely in important games.

User avatar
Luizinho94
 
Posts: 61
Joined: 2012 Jun 06, 13:38
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Anders » 2012 Jun 10, 01:43

Luizinho94 wrote:His mentality can be reduced as well, because he disappears completely in important games.

LOL, he as champion of Libertadores basically carrying his team and with great performances in all decisive matches, played alone almost the last entire Brazilian champion as the entire Santos team was just waiting the FIFA Club World Cup, he is the main star of the Brazilian National team now, always heavy marked by at least 2 players, do you watched the macth that he destroyed Internacional, how high his attack was on that game to you?

Neymar is a genius not just on skill, but his overall intelligence on attack is complete different than most of the players, he is being so heavy marked that he generally always need to use a body feint to open a space so he can receive a pass, who is marked like that on Brazil, does Hulk is marked like that, Hulk has ATK 85, the reason that he is doing some bad matches, is not because he isn’t so good is thanks to good defensive systems made to nullify him, giving him very few space to create anything, don’t you ever saw a good defensive system nullifying players like Messi or C. Ronaldo and because of that they end up mixing good matches with bad matches. I think is too harsh to judge Neymar by what, 4~5 bad matches, 89 of ATK don’t make him score hat-tricks on every game, but is a value that can represent how smart he is, he is on a different level than other players.

He did a god match against Argentina today, Mano Menezes changed his position making him play more as AMF than as a pure SS and he adopt to that really fast, he created good opportunities that are missed by his team mates and opened a good space pushing some defenders away, the defenders need to stop him with fouls sometimes resulting on cards (Thing he is always doing, that generally obligate to change his marker or will take a risk of the defender receive a red card), he suffered one penalty that the refer didn’t gave, made 2 assist with I not mistake and almost scored 2 or 3 times, nothing bad huh.

I have being work really hard trying to constroy a good balance of our league with the others, is hard as we rarely play against an Europe team, we don't have teams good as the Europe top teams, such as Milan, Juventus, Barcelona, Madrid, Manchester, etc... Though Internacional manage to play nearly the same level as Bayer, Milan and Barça on Audi cup.
I have comparing every player that I can watch that moves from here to Europe and vice-versa and thanks to this I'm building a balance on my OF, I'm sure that our good players on Brazil are able to maitain the same level at any good Europe team, as I saw Miranda (Atletico M.), Marquinhos (A.S. Roma), etc... and even play on a complete diferent level as Armero manage to make on Udinese, sometimes they don't manage to adept on other team, but that happens everywhere Quaresma on Internationale din't manage to play at same level as on Porto and I'm sure that wasen't because portuguese ligue is worst than Serie A.

I’m sure that Neymar is fully balanced and that this ATK 89 is fully deserve, say that he should play like he does on Santos at national team to be an 89 is bullshit, Internacional games are on a different level; with he manage to do the same that things he does in here on EPL, Serie A or Champions League he certainly would be on red and not on 89, imagine him tearing the Argentina national team apart as he did with Internacional, he would prove he is better than this, and not just justify why he has 89.

User avatar
Anders
 
Posts: 1587
Joined: 2010 Apr 01, 17:27
Location: Brazil
Has thanked: 10 times
Been thanked: 13 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby camisa1 » 2012 Jul 01, 13:09

I think ATT is too high. 86-87 would be enough, imo. Alexandre Pato is rated at 85 and he's already proven at european level (I guess?). Sure Neymar is really smart when attacking, but I've seen him doing a lot of mistakes, even at brazilian league levels, and nowadays he's just getting easier to mark. Shot Accuraccy could be lowered too, 84 seems ok already. And I also think Short Pass Acc/speed should be improved, he often does a lot of clever passes, his completion rate isn't so high because he often tries hard ones, but I still think they could be 82 and 80 respectively.

Great player, can't wait for when he overcomes Messi :)

camisa1
 
Posts: 38
Joined: 2012 Jun 10, 13:17
Location: Brazil
Has thanked: 0 time
Been thanked: 0 time

Re: NEYMAR

Postby Yazid » 2012 Jul 01, 19:52

He will not overcome messi.

Yazid
 
Posts: 876
Joined: 2011 Jan 16, 23:34
Has thanked: 6 times
Been thanked: 55 times

Re: NEYMAR

Postby vinnie » 2012 Jul 01, 19:56

premature but i agree for sure. Robinho v.2.0 (but much better to be fair), he'll be a pretty great player i trust, regardless of any comparisons.

If you don't put effort into your post, i won't put effort in my response.
User avatar
vinnie
 
Posts: 3585
Joined: 2012 Apr 06, 03:11
Location: ♛      
Has thanked: 363 times
Been thanked: 535 times

PreviousNext

Return to FC Barcelona

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 1 guest