Alfredo Di Stéfano | 1953-1958

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Alfredo Di Stéfano | 1953-1958

Postby Brezza » 2008 Dec 10, 17:54

Club: Real Madrid

Nickname: "Blond Arrow"


Growth type: Standard/Lasting

INFO:

Spoiler: show
Arguably the most complete footballer of all time. Physically powerful, with unparalleled stamina, amazing skills and unwavering determination to win. He was capped by three countries, but ironically failed to take part in a World Cup! His other achievements were sensational enough to warrant him a place among the top players in the history.

After making a name for himself as a all-round attacker in Argentina, he went on to play in the then "outlawed" Colombian league with Millonarios from Bogota, where his goal average was almost one per game. He was approaching what was then considered veteran age when signed by Real Madrid.

It was the balding Argentinean who turned Real Madrid from Spanish also-rans into the biggest club, on the planet. He lead them to five consecutive European Champions' Cups, scoring in each and every final!

His most famous display was perhaps the one against Eintracht Frankfurt in Glasgow, when he netted three times (Puskas went one better) in a 7-3 win for the Spaniards.

Di Stefano is not far behind Pele or Maradona, and he's probably even more complete than Cruyff. His teammates often said that he was fantastic in defense (and could even play in goal), and probably no one had more stamina than him, ever. His position was a striker along side Puskas but from the videos I watched and the stuff I read he played like a DM more than half the time. He would often drop deep to defend his goal, win possession and play it to the wingers or bring it up himself hence high defense, lowish aggression and covering.

"Alfredo Di Stéfano was the greatest footballer of all time - far better even than Pelé. He was, simultaneously, the anchor in defence, the playmaker in midfield, and the most dangerous marksman in attack." - Helenio HERRERA

VIDEOS:

Spoiler: show


ADDITIONAL LINKS:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfredo_di_St%C3%A9fano

http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfredo_di_St%C3%A9fano

http://www.spiritus-temporis.com/alfredo-di-stefano/

http://www.football-history.net/who-is- ... tefano.htm

http://www.ifhof.com/hof/alfredodistefano.asp

Last edited by vinnie on 2014 Jun 07, 21:28, edited 21 times in total.
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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby ingus » 2012 Apr 20, 15:46



The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Kazu » 2012 May 09, 15:31

Looking at this video I'd rather prefer the default stats ( Like I almost always did ) with its very low SPS/LPS , nor I'm very convinced about such a high value in TECH , he took way more time to conrol the ball in compare to other players who are sitting on the same or similar number for TECH + he had a lot of space and time to control the ball .

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby ingus » 2012 May 09, 15:33

these stats are totally overblown in unessacrry areas... like cruyff with the sps and what not.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Korinov » 2012 May 12, 12:10

Kazu wrote:Looking at this video I'd rather prefer the default stats ( Like I almost always did ) with its very low SPS/LPS , nor I'm very convinced about such a high value in TECH , he took way more time to conrol the ball in compare to other players who are sitting on the same or similar number for TECH + he had a lot of space and time to control the ball .


That video is from 1963, when he was... 37, 38 years old?

On the other hand I agree this set (and many other sets from this period) could use a revamp. Too many 'total footballers' in the DB with yellow values or more in pretty much every single stat.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Basilio » 2012 May 12, 14:24

this set could use work from 'konami edit' i reckon

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby ingus » 2012 May 17, 04:07

Basilio wrote:this set could use work from 'konami edit' i reckon


I'd like to, but theres so much crap involved with classics... I mean true classics, the players I usually don't touch as I'm not so interested in them. I mean theres the whole.. he was strong/fast for his time, you need to rate players back on what the max capability of players were back then. Which to me.... is not something I'd like to do. You can clearly see someone like Roy keane would just tear this man apart in a physical confrontation if it came down to raw power, but would that happen in game? No. And it wouldn't come down to raw power, that was keanes strenght... not di stefano's he wouldn't try to outmuscle roy keane, he'd gracefully avoid getting into that situation. But apparently hes worth 86 for his time.... so what do you do? I don't know. It makes players unrealistic imo when comparing them among multiple generations.

Speaking of players like this (real classics).. I'm mostly only familar with those who have youtube player vs insert team name vids.. but these are really more than enough to see what sort of stats the player has. Di stefano is a strange player... I mean hes supposed to be an AMF but his movement is really everywhere so I'd never really class him as that... as such it's hard to put generic role attack value on him. I'd say his intelligence is waaay above his time, his movement link up play, ability to see a pass is great, he creates a lot of danger so I'd opt to give him a really high value for attack... but again... it comes down to the time period.. for todays game I wouldn't give him a 95... but then for the time he has to be a 95.. and I guess thats why konami gave him that. Theres too many varations and stioulations for rating players like this. Honestly, I just want to create them on what I see, so they'll play like they looked (like jez said) on the pitch. But eh... who knows what the stance is on this nowadays... either way... this set is real inaccurate in many areas.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby kuer86 » 2012 May 17, 15:36

i think we should rate these "real classic" players, like konami would do! because, this players are real legends and i want them to play like legends when i play with or against them in pes.

i just watched "garrincha vs england 1962" on youtube...and really, i`m not impressed by him....ok, you can see that this guy was really talented...but in this video he always uses the same trick and he hardly fails with only this one trick and the reason is imo bad defending. i dont think he could do something against an a.cole or evra today. so if we just rate what we see in videos, i believe the "real classic" players would be nothing special anymore and i think this wouldnt feel right. so maybe we should give this players other standards, like we never saw a football game in the last 30 or 40 years. For example...a player who was the fastest of his time and nowadays would be just fast and maybe getting ts like 87 or sth..i think we should rate him as he would be the fastest player today and give him an 92+ or something like that...

and i think this guys were not less talented then the worldclass players today...so if they would train under the same conditions like the players today...they would be among the best players today

sorry for my bad english

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Yazid » 2012 May 17, 17:11

^ Agree, I think its the only way you can do it really otherwise the classic players pre 1970 are barely worth creating. An example of this is that di stefano is descirbed as the most complete footballer ever, but in today's standards, I doubt he would even be the most complete player right now.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby ingus » 2012 May 17, 17:22

No he still would be. I can't see anyone else who plays even remotly similar to him. The technical side of the game is differnt..

i think we should rate these "real classic" players, like konami would do! because


If we do this that means way less in the physical atributes and speed stats... as well as stamina. Konami have him on 75 BB 90 sta.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Brezza » 2012 May 17, 17:30

Its not completely the case for him having certain stats because he 'needs it for his era' their just simply overblown in some areas imo. But then the stats are a few years old made with different standards comparisons with other classic players etc.

Di Stefano was a strong player but it wasn't really his style to reley on pure physically like you said, he was quite subtle when taking in players . I also quite like the route were'e taking in giving similar low passing speed values to classic players that Konami has done. Replicates the style of football back then better

Also like ive said a thousand times, comparing classic players from an entirely different era with modern football is completely illogical. Of course players are fitter and are more advanced tactically in todays game but it doesn't automatically mean that classic players are shit like most kids on here want to believe. they're just limited in the era they are in. Its sorta the equivalent of saying the Roman empire was a shit fighting force if you compare it to modern warfare tactics for today or something. :lol:

Just go with what you see, Di Stefano was an unbelievably intelligent player that could play the role of about 4 different players. incredible Linkup and support of a Cruyff or a Xavi. Technically elegant on the ball like Zidane. Amazing box to box midfielder with pace and limitless stamina., World class finisher you name it. But then I agree with replicating the style of football of those times with things like shot power, passing speed, Dribble speed etc which are just overblown here. Kind of a mix between Konami's and our own.

As for an overall update I quite like Madvillains set. but I'd probably give him low yellows for dribble speed, more extreme passing speed values but I'd like to keep Teamwork were it is. He's probably the most influential players ever on the pitch. pretty much at the heart everything that happened, just like Bobby Charlton's first impressions of him.

""Who is this man? He takes the ball from the goalkeeper; he tells the full-backs what to do; wherever he is on the field he is in position to take the ball; you can see his influence on everything that is happening... I had never seen such a complete footballer. It was as though he had set up his own command centre at the heart of the game."


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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby frshmn » 2012 May 17, 17:38

Brezza wrote:As for an overall update I quite like Madvillains set. but I'd probably give him low yellows for dribble speed, more extreme passing speed values and as you said I'd keep Teamwork were it is. He's probably the most influential players ever on the pitch. pretty much at the heart everything that happened, just like Bobby Charlton's first impressions of him.


Haha, I didn't want to interject and mention my set because it'd seem like I'm imposing, but I've been waiting with bated breath for someone to mention it. :P

DS has been upped to a low yellow figure (81) at the request of Los Merengues, but I guess passing speeds need tweaking. Any suggestions, Brezza?

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby ingus » 2012 May 17, 17:38

I prefer Konamis set tbh with just some slight tweaks. I would never give him that 99 stamina, and it's not because of his era. Hes just not in the position where he warrants that imo, yes he ran a lot. But he is in an advanced role regardless and as such doesn't need to expend anywhere near as much energy as a SB or CMF. But hes so far above absolutely everyone which isn't right.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby kuer86 » 2012 May 17, 17:42

i have one question...players like di stefano had to play with heavier balls, so because of this there ds, sps and sp is a bit lower compared to "modern" football players, shouldnt we give them 1, or 2 extra points in this areas? because in pes there is no thing like a heavier ball and today there ds, passes and shots would be faster

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby frshmn » 2012 May 17, 17:43

jurgens wrote:I prefer Konamis set tbh with just some slight tweaks. I would never give him that 99 stamina, and it's not because of his era. Hes just not in the position where he warrants that imo, yes he ran a lot. But he is in an advanced role regardless and as such doesn't need to expend anywhere near as much energy as a SB or CMF. But hes so far above absolutely everyone which isn't right.


I've never actually seen the Konami's Di Stefano set. Do you mind posting it? :P

Last edited by frshmn on 2012 May 17, 17:53, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby ingus » 2012 May 17, 17:50

I think we both know you have ;)

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Korinov » 2012 May 17, 17:55

Not so sure about being a huge difference in Shot Power between the old days and nowadays... I just think it's a matter of the balls being vastly different. A few years ago I had some touches with a replica of an "old style" ball (made with leather strips and all that) and it was completely different from a modern ball, like a lot heavier and harder. And I was told that they got even heavier and harder when in wet conditions, probably to the point a current-day footballer would find himself almost unable to do anything with it. No doubt why some defenders from the old times put bandages on their heads when it started to rain. I mean, I'd like to see the tricksters from nowadays trying their favourite frivolities with such balls.

In any case I agree we should try to revamp this set (and others) in a way that would replicate the style of play of their time. If that means being extra-cautious when giving physical stats, I have no problem with it.

Edit: kuer86 just beat me about the balls issue.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Brezza » 2012 May 17, 17:57

kuer86 wrote:i have one question...players like di stefano had to play with heavier balls, so because of this there ds, sps and sp is a bit lower compared to "modern" football players, shouldnt we give them 1, or 2 extra points in this areas? because in pes there is no thing like a heavier ball and today there ds, passes and shots would be faster


Just go with what speed you see imo . I didn't agree with this at first because I thought things like lower speeds for passing and shot power would make the players pretty useless in game, but this just isn't the case at all.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Adrien » 2012 May 17, 18:00

Madvillain wrote:
jurgens wrote:I prefer Konamis set tbh with just some slight tweaks. I would never give him that 99 stamina, and it's not because of his era. Hes just not in the position where he warrants that imo, yes he ran a lot. But he is in an advanced role regardless and as such doesn't need to expend anywhere near as much energy as a SB or CMF. But hes so far above absolutely everyone which isn't right.


I've never actually seen the Konami's Di Stefano set. Do you mind posting it? :P



Spoiler: show
Name: Di Stéfano


Position: SS*, AMF, CF, CMF
Nationality: Spanish _spa
Age: 31

Foot: R
Side: B

Length: 178
Weight: 71

Attack: 95
Defence: 75
Balance: 75
Stamina: 90
Top Speed: 84
Acceleration: 85
Response: 88
Agility: 85
Dribble Accuracy: 92
Dribble Speed: 85
Short Pass Accuracy: 90
Short Pass Speed: 75
Long Pass Accuracy: 90
Long Pass Speed: 75
Shot Accuracy: 95
Shot Power: 80
Shot Technique: 88
Free Kick Accuracy: 80
Curling: 85
Header: 77
Jump: 75
Technique: 90
Aggression: 83
Mentality: 89
Keeper Skills: 60
Team Work: 95

Injury Tolerance: A
Condition/Fitness: 7
Weak Foot Accuracy: 7
Weak Foot Frequency: 5

S05 - 1-touch Play
S06 - Outside curve
P17 - Free Roaming
P19 - Chasing Back
P20 - Talisman


Between, they put him spanish, and the stats of ST and agression is yours (because I haven't stats of older Konami classic)

Last edited by Adrien on 2012 May 17, 18:04, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Brezza » 2012 May 17, 18:03

Korinov wrote:Not so sure about being a huge difference in Shot Power between the old days and nowadays... I just think it's a matter of the balls being vastly different. A few years ago I had some touches with a replica of an "old style" ball (made with leather strips and all that) and it was completely different from a modern ball, like a lot heavier and harder. And I was told that they got even heavier and harder when in wet conditions, probably to the point a current-day footballer would find himself almost unable to do anything with it. No doubt why some defenders from the old times put bandages on their heads when it started to rain. I mean, I'd like to see the tricksters from nowadays trying their favourite frivolities with such balls.

In any case I agree we should try to revamp this set (and others) in a way that would replicate the style of play of their time. If that means being extra-cautious when giving physical stats, I have no problem with it.


I actually watched a documentary a while ago where a group of Keepy-uppy champions were given a classic leather ball to practice their (circus) skills on. They couldn't pull of more than 3 :lol: But that's what Ive said countless times, there's just too many variables / swings and roundabouts to consider when comparing players from different eras, or how well a player would play in a certain era.. Its complete nonsense.

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Re: Alfredo DI STÉFANO | 1953-1957

Postby Korinov » 2012 May 17, 18:04

ST 92 and AGG 80 in PES 2011.

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