Sergio Pellissier

[jmg721]

[jmg721]

Can you tell me if there is a harder working CF in the Serie A. If he had more talent & size he would be a world beater.

[Rfuna]

Can you tell me if there is a harder working CF in the Serie A. If he had more talent & size he would be a world beater.

Lavezzi, T. Rocchi, Di Natale.

[nico90]

ok rocchi, ok di natale but lavezzi

[jmg721]

I think we have touched base on 4 of the most hard working CF. I get the Tevez comparison.... He does seem to be cut from the same cloth, and neither of them are starting for the NT
Pellissier: 36(Def)/82(ment)
Rocchi: 41/84
Di Natalie: 39/80
Lavezzi: 44/81

They seem rated pretty well. I might suggest a raise in Pellissier's Def by a point or two. I'm not sure about Rocchi being more hardworking...but I have really seen him at top form.

[jmg721]

Short Pass Accuracy: 74
Short Pass Speed: 73
Long Pass Acc.: 70
Long Pass Speed: 71

I don't want to be too generous with his passing stats, because he is a CF and not as good of a passer as Zarate for example. But he does have nice passes, and even some nice touch LP this season that have resulted in assists. Currently his passing stats look pretty similar to Zarate's. Plus Pellissier has better TW. If I were to suggest anything....maybe 72 LPA?

2004/05 ChievoVerona A 33 games 7 goals
2005/06 ChievoVerona A 34 games 13 goals
2006/07 ChievoVerona A 36 games 9 goals
(2007/08 ChievoVerona B 37 games goals 22)

Currently he has started in all 28 games this season playing full matches in all but 4 matches where he was subbed in the 79', 85', 85', 87'. All but one were tactical moves when they were ahead or tied. Plus looking at his record of playing in matches over the past 5 years....I have to suggest:

Condition/Fitness: 7 or 8 (leaning towards 7 just because he doesn't have to deal with European or NT schedules)
Stamina: 85(on par with Gilardino)
Defence: 38(looking at discussion above)
Injury Tolerance: A(hasn't missed any significant time over 5 years....and he does take a like of hits being his size and competing in the top level vs. much larger guys.)
LPA: 72(mentioned above)

[nico90]

I agree with you

[Oriello]

I only have a qualm with the Conditioning of 7 or "8"? For 33 to 37 games player? I do not want to go apeshit as I am struggling to keep my typing intact , but then where would the likes of Lampard or Pele who both can or could manage 60 games a season (Pele sometimes nigh 70 games). I know that PES is somewhat shit at keeping players fresh and that players do tire quickly (personally cannot fathom these 1-8 scales why not 1-10? ), but there must be a ladder maintained to respect those players that do show when they are given the oppurtunity through multiple competitions and play 50+ games in one season that they should be a standard apart from all others and an 8 in Conditioning is what that is for (Of course if minutes are avialable then I would think at or approaching the 4500 minutes a season mark would be a great indicator.)

Rio Ferdinand managed 52 gmaes last season, yet with the possible updated values Pellissier would only be -1 point below in Stamina.

I know Sergio has the unfortunate fact working against him that he does not participate in too many competitions, beyond league and cup, but the league appearances you listed would only strike me as a Conditioning 6, personally 40 games is the marke I see for Conditioning 7 or approxiametly 3600 minutes.

Yet I do aknowledge that you stated he has started every game this season and only four substitutions...little calculation (bear with me I am terrible at the arthmetics )..so 2856 is the numbers I scratched out on paper, so he is about 744 minutes or eight more full matches away from a definate 7, so what another nine games left in the season. Yet anyways like I was writing that I can see your point through your proposed Injury Tolerance upgrade that he is not frequently found recovering on the sidelines, also meaning he usually is playing nearly every minute, so if he reaches another 36 game season - with three in a row I could very well be for the 7.


Oh yeah I noticed me suggesting a 7 for Di Natele a little while back, you can note that down to me being a dumbass , I have since had a rethink of how to properly rate the Conditioning in respect to those fewer athletes that truely deserve to be recognized at the 8 mark.

[Rfuna]

Whoa Oriello, there's 100 word limit per post, didn't you get the memo . Jason, why do I get the impression you're a soon-to-be-chievo fan. Here are minutes of some the CFs mentioned in the last 2 posts.

Pellissier2586
Lavezzi2235
Zarate 2223
Zlatan2417
Di Natale1342
Gilardino2167

Surprise, surprise, Pellissier has the most minutes of any forward. But musn't we also consider distance ran per match? Minutes played only tells half the story. Afterall, this is why CMFs and DMFs often have the highest stamina/condition values.

[Oriello]

Yeah I missed that memo -- but I did get the all important one about upcoming vacation pay for the past week off at the end of March. ;P

Thanks for the links to the sources.

That is true about players who tax up great mileage during matches, but I rather reward/rate them with more Stamina -- assuming they can handle all that extra work wthic, otherwise just leave them with a high Mentaltiy to push through the fatigue.

jmg721 you posted you want to raise Sergio's Stamina to 85 on par with Gilardino, but he is actually at 86 -- really these two could be swapped if not Pellissier to an 86-87 while Gilardino to a 85, really the Chevio man is by far a better hard worker, he really does work hard -- there was a Pellissier goal two weeks back that really summed Sergio up in one goal where he hasseled for the ball, at 1:20 shite man!

And Ibra is at 84 now and Pellissier who actually runs is supposed to only be +1 point better? I agree with Rfuna on the point of those forwards who cover ground like central midfielders should be rated near or like them, Kuijt being the extreme example, Tevez Rooney others, Pellissier though at poor Cheivo and not in many prestigious competitions and a slightly slower league is he really that far behind, at 85 he would be -8 points behind Rooney.

[jmg721]

I honestly posted that in hopes to get responses from both of you....but now I don't know where to start to respond....(insert overwhelmed face)

Jason, why do I get the impression you're a soon-to-be-chievo fan.

I honestly am a fan of players, and teams with players I enjoy to watch. As I am routing for Chievo to play in the Serie A next season...I would definitely currently say my support is like this: Fiorentina, Torino, Lazio, Chievo, Atalanta, Catania, Palermo, Cagliari, Sampdoria, Napoli.

I seriously support just about all of those teams, and it changes game by game.

50+ games 4500 minutes in one season that they should be a standard apart from all others and an 8 in Conditioning.

40 games approxiametly 3600 minutes is the mark I see for Conditioning 7

So let me get this straight....You basically need to be playing for a team that plays deep into Europe or Cup matches in order to be given a 7. The fact that he has played almost every min for his team over the past 5 seasons, and this season he's played more minutes than all of those guys who have 7's. My main crusade on this site is to make sure that players on smaller clubs are getting a fair shake. And to me it seems harsh to not give him a 7.

Okay, so looking through this basically we are saying his Conditioning has to stay at a 6 untill he can get some European Appearences.....but we will look at raising his Stamina. Were you formally suggesting an 87 Oreillo? I got the feeling you felt 85 was greatly underrating him.

So the new look Suggestions would be:
Condition/Fitness: 7 (if he basically plays every minute till the end of the season)
Stamina: 87
Injury Tolerance: A
Defence: 38
LPA: 72

[Rfuna]

The fact that he has played almost every min for his team over the past 5 seasons, and this season he's played more minutes than all of those guys who have 7's.

ah, but you forget some of these players have either had a long spell on the sidelines (Di Natale) or haven't been picked to play (Rocchi). While we're at it, why don't we give the njury prone Totti 7 for condition, and 85 for stamina.

2004/05 40 games 13 goals
2005/06 27 games 17 goals
2006/07 56 games 31 goals
2007/08 32 games 16 goals

All of the above are games started by the way. Some the appearances Pellissier made were as a substitute but you failed to mention that. You say that you're on a crusade to ensure that players on smaller clubs get a "fair shake", there are players on bigger clubs who still need work. Anyway, as I said before, appearances is only half the story, we ahould consider mileage also, but since that isn't available to us, and I haven't really watched Pellissier play, I'll take your word and Oriello's that he's a hard worker, and so I'm for 7 condition. BUT surely players like Maicon ought to be upgraded to a 8

Stamina: 85(on par with Gilardino)

I think you'll find that Gila's played more games anyway.

PS does ST have to only 80

[Oriello]

So let me get this straight....You basically need to be playing for a team that plays deep into Europe or Cup matches in order to be given a 7. The fact that he has played almost every min for his team over the past 5 seasons, and this season he's played more minutes than all of those guys who have 7's. My main crusade on this site is to make sure that players on smaller clubs are getting a fair shake. And to me it seems harsh to not give him a 7.

Well I actually wrote that I could Agree for a Conditioning 7 for Pellisier if he manages another 36 game season in regard to him being played quite consistently non stop for so many seasons, but this should be an uncommon exception. If you were questioning in general, then yes I believe that only players who prove themselves physically being able to handle the rigours of so many mathces should be rated in the upper echelons of the Conditioning values. Similar to how if Giovinco was wowing us all with wonderful touches and dribbling in Serie B could/would he get rated at high values despite the lower level of opposition as he might be able to replicate Maradona like domination in Serie A? no. Same with the Conditioning if a players is given the oppurtunity through whatever competitions to showcase long term endurance and performs to what was asked then he has demostrated the ability, though it might be true some great athletic players could handel as many games as Rio Ferdinand, but we cannot assume, same as we cannot assume A Maradona like Giovinco in Serie B would be like Diego in Serie A. Poor analogy but that is the best I got on the fly.

Okay, so looking through this basically we are saying his Conditioning has to stay at a 6 untill he can get some European Appearences.....but we will look at raising his Stamina. Were you formally suggesting an 87 Oreillo? I got the feeling you felt 85 was greatly underrating him.

No seeing as he is a A INJ type player who rarely is sidelined I could see making a slight exception for Sergio due to his consistent appearances of league matches over several years. The Stamina I think would be better laddered at the 87 mark in view of some other forward, who I personally think both Gilardino and Ibrahimovic go pedistrian often, while Pellissier is more full of running, thus ladder wis it is a more fair representation. Unfortunately I am not privy to seeing him every wekk thus I am unsure of his fitness after a match is he like Molinaor a bit knackered after too much effort?


Condition/Fitness: 7 (if he basically plays every minute till the end of the season) -- Those 8 more games would be ideal as it would align him well in the minutes categories, but as I stated a minor exception may be made due to the multiple years of appearcanes, but do you by any chance have the figures on him being subbed in the other seasons?Stamina: 87
Injury Tolerance: A
Defence: 38
LPA: 72[/quote]


Rfuna you quoted me while it was jmg721's statement.


EDIT: just checked Maicons page http://www.inter.it/aas/squadra/player4 ... AG=2006/07, Minute wise 06/07 3874, 07/08 3488, 08/09 3772 - suprisingly he has not reached Zanetti like levels yet of approachijng 4500 minutes, maybe if the totals for Brazil caps can be found during the seasons possible (and posted in his thread for the case) totals could be calculated assuming full 90 mins in thos matxches, but based on Inter appearances the 7 seems right.

[Rfuna]

Another insightful but unnecessarily long post by Oriello . Sorry about quoting you incorrectly earlier.

Well I actually wrote that I could Agree for a Conditioning 7 for Pellisier if he manages another 36 game season

Agree!

Those 8 more games would be ideal as it would align him well in the minutes categories, but as I stated a minor exception may be made due to the multiple years of appearcanes, but do you by any chance have the figures on him being subbed in the other seasons?

Here you go. He's used a sub in quite a few games. He's not quite a 30+ man like other serie a strikers

EDIT: just checked Maicons page http://www.inter.it/aas/squadra/player4 ... AG=2006/07, Minute wise 06/07 3874, 07/08 3488, 08/09 3772 - suprisingly he has not reached Zanetti like levels yet of approachijng 4500 minutes, maybe if the totals for Brazil caps can be found during the seasons possible (and posted in his thread for the case) totals could be calculated assuming full 90 mins in thos matxches, but based on Inter appearances the 7 seems right.

yeah but you forget Zanetti doesn't do as much running, he play central, while Maicon runs up and down the field for all those matches. As I have said, minutes are only half the story, what about mileage?

[HitMan]

hat-trick masta, his speed is 83-84 from juve chievo match.. outran mellberg with no problem, and was on par with chiellini..

[Dino]

Agree with the speed suggestions

points dropped for Juve.... i'm so happy

[Rfuna]

Juve fans.

hat-trick masta, his speed is 83-84 from juve chievo match.. outran mellberg with no problem, and was on par with chiellini..

weren't his speed stats higher than this Jason my a 1/2pt increase for each is in order => TS:84, ACC:82. And ST ought to be 84/85

[Helios]

hat-trick masta, his speed is 83-84 from juve chievo match.. outran mellberg with no problem, and was on par with chiellini..

Melleberg is a great defender but he sadly lacks pace. The defensive midfielders were honestly very poor and didn't do their jobs and practically left the defensive line dealing alone with Pelissier and co, Chievo had so much space to launch their deadly counter attacks.

[Rfuna]

I’ll remember this day for a very long time

So will I Sergio... and so will Mellberg

[crisfar]

:lol: Juve fans.

hat-trick masta, his speed is 83-84 from juve chievo match.. outran mellberg with no problem, and was on par with chiellini..

weren't his speed stats higher than this Jason my a 1/2pt increase for each is in order => TS:84, ACC:82. And ST ought to be 84/85

I agree raing TS and ACC to the above values or even more, ACC 84 and TS 85, those are the best qualities of Sergio...